Dr. Maarten Hajer

Vincente Guallart

”In the digital world, we should reinvent globalization in such a way that we produce resources locally—energy, elements, and things—while we are globally connected.”

Lucas Epp

" China is definitely the largest market outside North America. But what is missing is local manufacture which can produce good quality woods that can be used in large constructions. "

Dr. Maarten Hajer

"When talking about wood urbanism, the importance is by re-relating nature to the society and finding a way to do it in a sustainable manner and that by no means is easy"

Ortiz Leon Architects

"Spain is the second country with the highest number of LEED certifications in the world."

The Talks

Interviewee

Dr. Maarten Hajer

Credits

Interviewer

Jose Morandeira

Published

March 08, 2022

D|W In your book, Smart about cities you mention how “a social movement is required to enlist science, the humanities, and us all to address the challenges we face building a planet of cities that can survive.” The agents in the built environment have the responsibility to take action and lead this movement. If the lead is to make wood as the main constructing material, how do you think it will influence the fate of the cities?.

M.H First it is necessary to go back to history and realize that we were extremely happy in the 20th century. It was a finding at that time to make buildings that were much healthier than the ones in the 19th century. However, the environmental consequences came and it is now a necessity to look for alternatives. This is already happening, as first-class architecture firms are already creating wooden buildings and many are enthusiastic about it. It is more than just building material, by bringing wood back as a building material, you immediately realize that the wood needs to be sourced, that it has to come from somewhere. It needs to be done in a sustainable manner. It cannot be about slashing down the forest in order to build beautiful wooden buildings. The ethical side of the material is more prominent and easy to understand than concrete. When talking about wood urbanism, the importance is by re-relating nature to the society and finding a way to do it in a sustainable manner and that by no means is easy.

THE TALKS

Dr. Maarten Hajer

Maarten Hajer is distinguished professor Urban Futures at the Utrecht University since October 2015. Before that he was professor of Public Policy at the University of Amsterdam (1998-2015) and Director-General of the Netherlands Environmental Assessment Agency (PBL – Planbureau voor de Leefomgeving,

Politics

D|W What is the government doing wrong? Can initiative be started from the governmental side?

M.H One of the reasons wood is still expensive, is that all the negative aspects of concrete are not priced in the cost of the concrete at the moment. The CO2 emission is not priced in. But that will be included soon, so the price of the concrete will go up and on the other hand, it would be fair to make wood cheaper to the extent that the wooden buildings can sink CO2, as wood stores CO2. If the next generation of architects find their ways to use wood and make sure that it will remain in the city for centuries, then it would be beneficial to the material should be made cheaper. Some of the new techniques of using wood, such as CLT, are far less able to reuse the wood that was used, it is difficult to deconstruct and reapplied. The canal house, behind the brick it’s wood and it has been in the built environment for centuries.

D|W What is the role of the citizens in these developments?

M.H If you look at innovation in building, It doesn't start in elite architecture. Now you see top architecture firms building in wood and there's a strange competition of building highrise in wood. I think this is the leftover of the 20th century. The idea of reaching for the sky is the best way of applying wood? I am not sure if that will hold. If you think about sociology, we are reminded of the time the car was introduced. The carriage made way for the car. The first models from Mercedes remarkably look like a carriage. In architecture something similar is happening, basically, now it is about replacing concrete but later we will realize that there's a more logical application in another way. The wood has a fantastic potential to build over the city as another layer, as it is a light material. It is often possible to build several layers on top of existing buildings, which is not possible by concrete.

"When talking about wood urbanism, the importance is by re-relating nature to the society and finding a way to do it in a sustainable manner and that by no means is easy"

D|W Do you have any other material that surpasses wood that could become more popular in the future?

M.H What I do see with wood is the challenge to source the amount of it that needs to be used in the built environment. Where are the forests? That can be sustainably used to get that much wood. There is already some tension in the market, as the demand is increasing. There's an absolute necessity to understand wood as a crop.